Permission to pause

Welcome to Seasons, a podcast about embracing the moments that change us. In this first episode, hosts Ndoni Khanyile and Mazuba Haanyama invite you into the conversations they’ve been having for years — the ones that have shaped who they are and who they’re becoming.

Together, they explore what it means to give yourself permission to pause in the midst of big transitions — in career, identity, motherhood, creativity, and purpose. Expect honesty, reflection, and laughter as they set the tone for a season filled with:
✨ Deep dives on navigating change
🌱 Stories from incredible women
🧭 Expert insights on finding your way

This is your invitation to take a breath, slow down, and join us in the in-between.

Transcript

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Introduction & Welcome

SPEAKER_00 0:00

I'm Doni, a storyteller and seeker, always curious about what makes us who we are. And I'm Mizuba, a dreamer and strategist, learning to find meaning in life's in-between moments.

SPEAKER_02 0:11

From Cape Town to Dubai, we're two friends in conversation about life, growth, and everything that moves us. Each season we explore a different theme. This one's about change. How it stretches us, surprises us, and teaches us to begin again. You're listening to Seasons of Change. So, first episode, first recording.

SPEAKER_01 0:33

How are you feeling? Uh nervous. I'm feeling very nervous. Um I talk to you more than probably any other living person I know. But um, and I often think that our conversations should be recorded. Uh and now that they are, I'm like, oh. Okay.

SPEAKER_00 0:59

I guess I should say something.

SPEAKER_01 1:02

Fine. Great. Simple, easy. But um yeah, I'm nervous, but I'm also excited.

SPEAKER_02 1:12

Me too. Lots of I'm good. I'm really looking forward to this. I'm feeling lots of excitement and positivity, a little bit of jitters, but it's um it doesn't feel like bad nervous. It feels like, ooh. So I'm feeling really good. Um, and like you say, you like we speak all the time. Um, other than the partner that I live with in my home, you are the person that I speak to the most. So um this feels a little beside the point because it's the two of us, but why don't we introduce ourselves a little bit for folks who will be listening at some point who don't know us? So um I'll go first, maybe, and then you can go second. Um you prefer that, I saw. Um so just like a quick roundup, which feels weird because it's like what do you keep and what do you leave out? But like a super, super pricey is that I am a trained performer. I'm a storyteller creative,

How This Podcast Began

SPEAKER_02 2:15

and use storytelling in many, many different forms. I am a mom, I live in Cape Town in South Africa with my family, and I am in a very significant kind of season of change in my life, and I'm navigating the in-between spaces of the person that I've been and the person that I'm consciously trying to move towards. So it's that constant carrying of a question of what do I take with me and what is it time to leave behind? And then also, what does that future vision of myself and my life that I really want to walk towards? And so I've been holding a lot of these questions for a while, but I'm really trying to do it with a lot more intention. And these are conversations we have a lot, but we thought, yeah, we'd maybe have this conversation in a slightly different way, um starting with today. So tell me a little bit about you, or tell the people a little bit about you.

SPEAKER_01 3:21

I really want to reflect on what you said for a moment because um I think like one of the things I value so much about you is like naming the moment. So when you said that you're sort of that in this in-between, I thought it's so good to first know that, right? One, and two, I'm I've been thinking a lot about like maybe we're all of the things already, right? But we're like remembering or reigniting them, you know, that the becoming exists. We're just like awakening to it. So we can come back to that.

SPEAKER_02 3:59

I love that.

SPEAKER_01 3:59

I guess one of the places with transition that I'm in is around my career. So I have no idea how to describe what I've done besides tech policy, movement building, grant making, but all of these words are a little bit boring. But that's what I've been doing for a long time. Um, maybe in a bit juicier way. I think I create partnerships that one wouldn't always think go together. I think I facilitate moments, conversations. Um that's what I know for now. Um, I live in Dubai, UAE, and have been living here for three years. I'm also a daughter, a sister, uh, a niece, an auntie, a cousin, and a granddaughter. Those feel important.

SPEAKER_02 5:02

Yeah. And if I can reflect just a little bit on what you said when you were trying to describe what it is that you do, because you've done things in so many different spaces. But I think you know, watching you all these years, a definite through line is that you are a born facilitator, it feels like. So you make you make space for possibilities to emerge. So you bring people together in a way where they can share in ways that they haven't before. You bring people together in a way where ideas and things can be created that would not have been possible otherwise. Like you just create the space physically, through conversations, emotionally, for things that could not have been before to come through. I feel like that is something that you do so naturally. It's just like it's an innate part of you. Um, and you just take that into all the spaces that you you occupy. Um I take it. I take it. Thank you very much. I take it. So, why a podcast? Why now? I mean, as if there are not enough podcast mics in the world. I mean, we just had to do one more.

SPEAKER_01 6:17

Why? Well, yeah, you know, it's really interesting this thing. I was thinking a lot about it. Um I think it's so nice that there's like a proliferation of podcasts, right? Because podcasts are kind of like radio shows, just different radio shows on a different medium, right? And it's just stories being told in different ways. And I love it. I love that they're popping up everywhere. I think that we should like flood the whole ecosystem with like different conversations. So I don't think that's like you know, one extra is great. Um I've been asking you to do a podcast with me for many years, uh, and then you called me and said, Let's do it. And I obviously I said yes. Um, but also I I like I believe so much in like documentation, right? Like I want to archive my life almost daily. I just I'm not able to to track, assess, understand, make sense of the evolution, right? And I think for me right now, which is what a lot of this podcast will be about in general, is just navigating an acute evolutionary moment, and to navigate that in conversation with someone that you love and care about and value their opinion is like fantastic. And we should record this always, which actually we have been doing before even this in different ways, yeah. Uh like you've been recording conversations. So now because it's possible, a podcast, because it's a groovy medium to use, and when the new one comes, we'll use the new one. But for now, this is pretty groovy.

SPEAKER_02 8:04

Yeah, no, ditto on all of those reasons. But another one that I would add is you know, something that we touched on that I think I can be guilty of sometimes because when I'm talking to you, because our conversations are a place of safety, you know what I mean? So I can bring my full self always to that conversation. So it's easier for me to talk through things in the middle of the mess, the confusion, the uncertainty. I talk through that with you. But when I'm speaking to other people outside of our conversational bubble of safety, I've noticed that like I'll talk about things after

Why “Permission to Pause”

SPEAKER_02 8:40

the fact. So after it's kind of neat and wrapped up and there's a bow and a ribbon on it, and it makes sense, and I'm talking about it in hindsight. But there is something that is that feels kind of self-protective about that, about why am I not able to be as open in the in the middle, in the process of. And in the moments that I do touch on things that are real and that are unresolved and that are possibly even messy in the moment with people, the the kind of connection resonance and like true connection that gets formed in those conversations is unreal because so many people are going through the exact same thing. And I've realized because you know, we're in our early 40s now. I've noticed that since the early, the late 30s into the early 40s, there is a significant shift that happens during this time of like there's a shedding, molding, like um uh what is it, a chrysalis kind of moment where like there's a new version of self that's coming through at this point in our lives, I feel. And we often just don't tell the truth about what it is, especially the hard parts, you know? So this feels like a really um incredible opportunity to challenge myself around that vulnerability, to just be, you know, a lot more open about processing in the moment and to let other folks know that like we are all in this. We are all trying to sort so many of the same things. We are all asking so many similar questions. Um, and just even knowing that feels better. But that there are things that we can take from, learn from, build on when we speak to each other and we share our truth. So this is feels like an opportunity to bring women and people together to share truths that we can all build on, that we can all take and use. Um, because that also feels feels important, that there's something that happens when we're isolated that that doesn't help us along the way, you know. So let's let's end that delusion and that illusion of isolation, because there's always folks out there who are in the same place, um, and see what can come, you know. So I'm excited for that. So we're talking about seasons of change. We're gonna be talking about that throughout the podcast episodes that we have. Um, so maybe just to dip our toes a little bit into what some of the the changes that we're both kind of holding in our life are and what they're bringing up for us. And you can even touch on one or two, because I know there's probably multiple.

SPEAKER_01 11:25

Um the obvious one for me at the moment is eclipsing all others that might exist. Um, and that's that I've uh been working like quite like wholeheartedly with my fingers and toes and every muscle I have in like one job for six years, and now my time at that job has come to an end, and I'm looking for a new job. Which at this point in my life feels different than others. One, I'm a parent, two, I live in a country that's not my home, like origin home. Um, I'm further along in my career than I've ever been. Uh, and so this pivot feels like it's demanding more of me than I might be willing to give. And that's like the biggest change. Um Yeah, I mean, m my kid goes to like big school uh end of the month, which feels like it's gonna be a transition in and of itself, perhaps in how I approach parenting. Um I'm navigating a postpartum body, which I just like consistently forget to acknowledge to myself. Um and marking the year feels quite significant. I had a big um I guess cosmetic operation, though it feels more than cosmetic, um, and I'm learning to be inside of that body. And we I moved homes. Wow, I moved houses. Yeah, I moved houses, and so getting used to this new space, those are like the significant changes I'm navigating. And maybe what it's bringing up. I don't know. I think like things that sometimes feel contradictory, but maybe are complimentary. There's parts of me that are like, I know change, I know what to do, I know how to make a plan, I'm gonna snap into it, let's go. And then there's a larger part of me that's feels like, oh, you should just like take it slower, you should calm down, you should relax a little more, love a little more, bask a little more, have fun a little more. Like, worry never gets you where you need to be. So why don't we just experiment with like trusting? Like you're gonna do all the stuff you need to do to get done what needs to get done, and then leave it. Like, then let that do what it needs to do, and enjoy this like mid-career, maybe towards the later

Mazuba’s Shift: Career, Motherhood & Identity

SPEAKER_01 14:30

part of my career, like sabbatical, which like I think every most folks I have worked with would love.

SPEAKER_02 14:37

Yeah, I feel that because a lot of times we don't choose how that moment of pause happens, right? Sometimes it's forced on us. Um, but nevertheless, just as kind of valuable. And for me, I think the beginning of this season of change, because I feel like I'm really kind of in the in the thick of it now, but it started at the beginning of COVID because COVID was kind of, and and we were all in the same boat where there was this enforced pause that brought with it so much chaos and so much just like uncertainty, three-month-old baby, all this work lined up, and then all of a sudden, hard pause and the world stops, and it's just you have no idea what it's gonna look like afterwards. But at the same time, that period was like a window of possibility of like, well, there's some other things that um life could look like um that are possible. And that just window of like, oh, what else could I be doing? What else should I be doing? Um just asking, sitting with those questions in the middle of all of the fear and uncertainty, a lot of things started to shift first internally, and then just in like my practical world, where um, you know, I started doing a lot of work that was different to what I'd been doing before. Um I trained as a coach, which is a completely new space for me. That coaching training took me into like a deep period of like self-reflection and really like looking at my own patterns of thinking, of belief, of behavior that had kind of shaped my reality in my life and seeing like, are those things still true? Do they ring true? Do they hold true? Is this who I am? Is this how I want to be? You know, just sitting with a lot of those bigger questions. And that has brought me to a place where I have both consciously and through kind of being forced through just the way life unfolds to let go of a lot of things that just really weren't serving me anymore. But I probably would have held on to them for a lot longer than I needed to had life not forced me to kind of let that go. Um so one of the things that's different is that now when things that feel hard happen, it's not the first thought, but one of the first thoughts that I now have is not just why is this happening to me? Because I used to sit in that kind of thought and feeling quite a lot, and to look at like okay, this isn't happening to me, maybe it's happening for me. And what is this an opportunity to now look at, sit with, think about? Um, and that has been a really interesting shift. So um seasons of change are just practical, like what life looks like, the work that I want to keep doing from the pre-COVID time in my life, possibly even the creative work that was like the first, the the initial things that made me want to be an actor, an artist? What are the things I've lost along the way that I really want to bring back because they feel like important and special and sacred? And what are the things that I picked up along the way that don't need to be there? And then also, like, what is it possible for me to live a life that is of my own making and my own design? Or do I have to fit into the parameters that an industry gives me or that um are kind of dictated outside of me? And this is now the place where I'm like, is it possible to live a life of my own making? Because sometimes that feels like it requires quite radical shifts inside me. It requires me to be brave enough to create a life that feels like me because that life doesn't always make sense to everyone around you. That feels like it requires a lot of courage. Um, so definitely sitting in the middle of that. And then also just sitting in the middle of like, in order to craft this life, to live this design of a life that I want, who do I have to be? So there's like an external reshaping of me that's happening, but it feels like there's also like a really important inside, like it's happening in like a dark space that no one can quite see yet, but that there's a new version of me that is forming itself. And that feels like a very internal, intimate, internal thing that's happening that feels like it's gonna want to need to spill out at some point. So I'm kind of walking through navigating the internal and the external, if that makes sense.

SPEAKER_01 19:50

I mean, you said a lot of things I want to reflect on. Um I think firstly, like I think kind of positioning this from COVID is is a so great. Um, because it kind of gives you a sense of how you've already been shaping and navigating the change. And as you were talking, I kind of thought, I wonder if you have some of these answers already, you know? And that to me, it looks like you are 100% living a life of design. But do you want to tweak that design? Sure. Absolutely. And who have you already been such that you've navigated to this point, right? Like you had a three-month-old baby during COVID, and you have two now, which is like massive, right? Um so yeah, I guess I'm interested in in in that, like, who have you already become? What how would you tweak the design that exists? And then I guess also I think that COVID part resonated particularly for me because I'm thinking about the change I'm in in this very moment, but like I had started a new job just before COVID, and so perhaps have been in a very particular place from then until now. Um, and maybe also something that resonated as you spoke or became um highlighted to me is how little time I've spent thinking about myself inside of my own life. Right? That like yeah, COVID

Ndoni’s Journey: Creative, Mom, Woman Redefining Self

SPEAKER_01 21:50

year, I got pregnant and then I just was on like autopilot, you know, and I've been thoughtful in the moments, you know, but I've just been doing uh just a lot of go. And sometimes I feel like it's it the energizer bunny, but the thing that you twist and then the thing that you can do. Yeah. Yeah. I feel like I like I I I I twisted it then in 2020 and like it's only like reaching end of steam now. But I I've just been move, you know, I've lived in three different places, I have done like three different like roles, I've just been go, and there is something important but uncomfortable about pausing.

SPEAKER_02 22:48

Yeah, and that feels so like I think most of us are really fearful of the pause. And part of that is by design because we live in a world that really rewards doing, doing, doing, doing your value, your worth is judged by your productivity, your output, what you do for others, who you are to others. And so we have this built-in fear that accumulates of what happens when I stop. Do things fall apart? Do I become irrelevant? Will my job still be there? Will this relationship still stand? All the things that we are conditioned to kind of worry about so that we can ignore our internal messaging and just keep doing, right? Yeah. Um, but this is something that the coaching program actually really brought into star clarity for me of like, we are human beings, and there is a fundamental humanity to just being able to stop and be, to feel into your breath in your body, to be in the moment, to just take inventory of like what is here right now inside, in my life, in my environment, how do I feel about it? How does it affect me? And it even feels like in this current global political moment, that we are being encouraged to not pause and think and feel. Because when you pause and think and feel, you cannot help but to be radicalized, moved, inspired, pulled into doing or moving in a different direction because you it's it inspires something so deep, right? But if we're just going like a robot, like that energizer bunny, you're just keeping those systems moving. So it feels like it's a deeply internal, sacred thing to just pause and to trust being in that moment of pause. But it also feels right now like those pauses that we're taking individually are also like some kind of larger global moment of like awakening as well. It's like if we all give ourselves permission to pause, what is possible? What is new that can come through? Because we are in the moment where we need new things, new ways of being, new ways of thinking, new ways of connecting with each other, new ways of being in community with each other and with ourselves. So these pauses are sacred. You know what I mean? So thank goodness for these pause, this pause moment that we're in now. And I'm so grateful that we've decided to take the leap together to say, let's be in community in our pauses. So, what is this podcast that we don't even have a name for yet, by the way? What is it gonna be? It's gonna be us reflecting on what's happening inside. It's gonna be us talking to each other about what's happening in our mutual worlds, our realizations, you know, penny drop moments, fears. Um, but it's also gonna be us inviting other people into this circle of conversation. Um do you want to talk a little bit about some of the kind of people you don't have to name names, but like what are the kind of people that we're gonna share this space with and why do we want to invite those people into the space? What do we hope to come of it?

SPEAKER_01 26:08

Yeah, um I think some of this you raised in the beginning about being community, right? So it feels a very long time ago when I did any work that involved community building, but at the heart of like our survival is like being together, you know? And it feels hard sometimes inside of the world that we live in to stand together. Uh organizing strategically well, I feel is hard, but it's so necessary. So I guess I'm curious to see who resonates with this conversation. You know what I mean? Um I'm a black queer woman, and so my time and my work and my resources will always be directed to that community 100%. But I'm welcoming voices and experiences of folks who are like, oh yeah, I hear that, I feel that, I wonder about that, you know. So for whomever it resonates with, I hope that they um join in the conversation with us, even if in their heads, in their rooms, in their cars. Um, I hope people will uh ask themselves more questions. I think that's something that also feels really important. Like, not only is it hard to pause, which I would never have thought myself as someone who finds it difficult to pause, because I find I I figure myself very reflective, but you know, debatable. But I think critical to navigating all moments of change is like asking questions, right, of ourselves, of each other, like big questions, small questions. And I think that's what we're gonna be doing here is asking ourselves many questions. Um I hope that people ask us questions. Uh, we're gonna talk to other folks who have navigated

What You Can Expect from This Season

SPEAKER_01 28:10

change in interesting ways, some who've done it and you know, want to tell a tale about it, others who are in it, you know, some who work in this field. But I think we're gonna ask a lot of questions, wanna reflect a lot, and I hope that it resonates for those who want to be in this conversation.

SPEAKER_02 28:32

And hopefully that this conversation can act as a tool and a resource of sorts, that it can um it can instigate some internal questioning and thinking that perhaps it can spark questions that you can bring to your own community of family, friends, beloveds, that it can just spark and catalyze some things inside you and inside your communities, but to come back to these conversations whenever you may need them, because we're constantly navigating change. It's not a one and done. So hopefully these are conversations you can bookmark, come back to, because like we said, we'll be talking to incredible women. Like we said, for us, black women are always at the heart of our thinking, our creating, our making, because we are black women, we are born of black women. But also, um, I think when we address black women's humanity, their lives, their health, their joy, everybody reaps the rewards of that. So everybody is welcome to this conversation. We hope there is something for you here. The heart of this is black women. So we will be talking to some incredible black women who will share like some of their experiences of just like navigating seasons of change. But um also hopefully that we'll be able to speak to some people who have some tools, um, wisdom, and who can really give us some great juicy questions to chew on. People who can help us navigate that internal sacred part of change, as well as the external in the world navigating communities, work, identity, all of these things that navigate, like that determine how we show up in the world. So we'll be doing both of those at the same time. Um, I'm super excited about it, but I just thought of one thing. I looked up this morning, it came and I didn't realize. So it's the 8th of August today, 8, 8. So apparently the number 8 has got like spiritual astrological significance. It's like um, let me let me not guess things. I was gonna be like, it's about rebirth. I'm like, are you sure? Um do you want to double check that? So, anyway, the significance of the 8th of August is that it's something called the Lions Gate Portal, and it is on Instagram. You've been seeing it, right? Like, I've also been seeing it, but I was like, I don't know what's about, no, no, no, no. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And then I saw 8th of August, I was like, oh wait, but that's today. So what's up today? Because we were not meant to record today, we were meant to record earlier in the week. It was a thing, logistic thing with mics, so we pushed it to today, not knowing anything about anything. So it turns out that this 8th of August is the Lions Gate portal. I'm just gonna read what old Google says. Um, so what does the lions the Lion Gate represent? As the ancient Egyptians did, we can think of the Lions Gate as the beginning of a new year and likewise offer our reflections on the past and resolutions for the future. It's a time from for breaking free of form and cutting loose the patterns that prevent our becoming. Astrologically, the Lions Gate portal is believed to open a flow of energy between the spiritual and physical worlds, making it an ideal time for personal growth, transformation, and spiritual awakenings. So, halala girl, halala. That's correct. The most auspicious of days to start this. I love that. We didn't even know that. I love that. Exactly, exactly. And people who aren't into astrology or who don't matter, doesn't matter. It's fine, it's fine. We don't need to do all of that. We're just gonna take the good vibes. It's auspicious, lovely. This is the first day. We're gonna take it. Um, but yeah, so this is just a little taste

Closing Thoughts & Invitation

SPEAKER_02 32:30

of why we're doing this, what this is gonna be all about. Hopefully, you'll join us and walk with us as we ask ourselves some pretty interesting questions. Um, and our next episode, we're gonna be talking to our first guest who's gonna share her own personal stories of change. So really excited for you to catch the next episode, which will be a really, really wonderful guest that I think I'm very excited about her. So I hope people will be will enjoy the episode. Um, but then I kind of thought maybe before we go, can I ask one last little thing before we go?

SPEAKER_01 33:10

Yeah, yeah. So is it our closing question?

SPEAKER_02 33:13

Um, yeah. So I kind of thought that we we've covered a lot of just the initial things that I wanted us to cover: who we are, why we're here, why are we doing this, what can you possibly get from walking with us on this little journey we're on. But um I think to leave us with is that like, what is one bold truth and one quiet hope that you're holding in this moment right now for this journey?

SPEAKER_01 33:47

For this podcast journey? Uh the bold truth is that like bountiful love and fun and joy is always available and accessible when you do it with people that you love. And I have been loving you for many years, and so that is very accessible and available for me in this one quiet hope. Yeah. Oh, um, that we just keep going for like a really long time. I like don't want to do one season, I want to do like several. I just basically want to keep doing this for a really, really long time.

SPEAKER_02 34:39

Ditto, ditto, yeah. One one bold truth, which feels like such a nice truth to acknowledge, because I think there was a time in the recent past where I felt like lacking support in the physical structures of my day-to-day life. And I think that's part of just being uh a mother to like small kids, postpartum, you're dealing with body shifts, children, the demands of time, hormones, all the things. And I had not yet learned how to ask for the things that I needed, and I had not taught the people around me how to support me because I've been on this, I can do everything. I'm a one-woman machine, I'm a blah-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da that we're always on. And so I suffered far more than I needed to, or for feeling unsupported, feeling alone, and feeling overburdened. And one bold truth that I can really sit in this morning that feels so good to say is that I have so, I feel so supported in my life in this moment. You know, like I told you, um, this this is I'm sitting in what is an extra guest room in my house. And I told Mazuba before we started that if you had to just change the the angle of the camera this way, it would be a lot less organized. There's a lot of stuff that's been pushed into that corner. Um, but I I just I was meant to clear up this room to make space for this conversation yesterday, and I just was too busy. I didn't get to it. And um, while I was showering, my husband, without me asking, just came in here and got things together, got it sorted, you know, and it was just such a wonderful feeling to feel like rushed getting out of the shower, like, oh, we've got to do all this stuff, da da da da da. And he walked in. It was like the space was sorted. The space was here, it was waiting for me. Things had been swept, things had been tidied, things had been, and I just felt like that is so like that is my love language. If I have one, is just like, oh my god. And I didn't even have to ask. Like, I don't think I have loved him more in a long time than I did in this moment this morning, and was just so grateful to have that. Because I I remember not so long ago where I felt like very much the opposite. Um, so yeah, I that's a very bold truth that I sit with right now. That I feel very supported in this moment. Um and one quiet hope. I just I kind of want us to be able to have conversations about all kinds of things for the rest of our lives, and that's what we do for work. Somehow I just want that to be what we do, and we do it forever until we're old. So um, yeah, so may it be. So may it be. I'm so glad I'm doing with this with you, and I love you so much.

SPEAKER_01 37:36

I literally love you so much.

SPEAKER_00 37:38

Thanks for listening to this episode of Seasons. If something in this conversation resonated with you, share it with someone you think might be interested too.

SPEAKER_02 37:47

And if you enjoyed listening, please rate or review the show. It really helps people find us. Until next time, take care and keep growing through your season.